Ask Us Anything - Everything You Want to Know About Floor Heating


Our radiant experts answer all your questions about floor heating. We review the various electric systems we offer as well as potential underlayments. The smartplans reviewed during this webinar help demonstrate how each system is installed depending on the flooring material and subfloor for your project.

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Video Transcript

Hello Thank you so much for joining us today. It is our first webinar of 2023. We're going over everything you want to know about floor heating, so ask us anything that you have been wondering about, any upcoming projects you might have or about our products. My name is Lynn. I am a customer service trap here at warm yours. I am joined by. My name is Scott. Thank you for joining us. Awesome So we are about to jump right in. If you have any questions on the presentation today, please feel free to ask either in the sidebar chat or at the bottom of the screen in the Ask a Question module. If we don't see your question right away, I will definitely get to it by the end of the presentation. I see Carolyn already sent in one saying can the standard mesh mats be installed in the shower? Yes essentially, Yeah. We do have shower mats that are basically the only difference is that they're pretty sized for most average sized, laid out showers. So any kind of temp stone product is rated for wet locations. So it would be perfectly fine. Yeah, we don't do custom mats very much anymore, but custom ads are not a wet location listed, so any of our cut and turn products, any of our cable, that sort of stuff that can all go in the shower. So if you have a size that's not a normal size, then you would probably want to be doing cable or something similar to that. And that wire is wet location listed. So very good. Thank you for your question right off the bat. That's excellent. And it's one that we know. How exciting is that? So talking about timezone, this is probably our most popular product that we offer for floor heating specifically because it's really compatible with the majority of types of flooring that we see people putting in tile stone hardwood, including linoleum and vinyl, also luxury vinyl tile, luxury vinyl planks. All of that tends to be compatible with temp stone. And like we had touched on briefly earlier, we do also have those shower floor and bench mats that are pretty sized for those specific locations. So all of these products are wet location listed and they're very thin. So can you kind of tell us, Scott, what they add to the floor height or things like that? Oh, very little because they're in there included in the 3/8 of a half inch or 3 eights or a half inch of self-leveling that is used for a lot of the jobs or the 3/8 to a half inch of thinset. So the cable actually goes in that 3/8 inch level layer. So there really isn't any the wire doesn't add any height. It kind of lives in that thinset that you need to get the correct thickness of. So it doesn't raise it very much at all because it's very thin to begin with. And both of the products are very, very good attempts on with LV ti and linoleum and stuff like that. What it's what happens with that to get those to work is it's covered, it's laid out on the sub floor, then covered with self-leveling and that's what gives you the flat floor. So you kind of creating a heated subfloor that you're just laying this other stuff on top of. So that's what's very, very handy when you're doing linoleum in elevator that needs a flat surface. Awesome yeah, absolutely. And then we also have loose cable for timezone. So it's essentially the same product, it's that same heating cable. It's just a loose cable sort of being on that mesh. So we have different ways that you can lay that out, either using fixing strips. Those are the little red lines you can see there. Basically they attach to the subfloor and you can kind of use them to hook the cable in as you run it back and forth. Or we also have our cell membrane, it's 7/32nds of an inch. So it is pretty thin. It's not going to add a whole lot of height difference to your floor. And that's a really good option if you're using anything like tile where you want a little bit of extra crack suppression. Yeah and when you're using a heating cable and if you're going to be using a floor surface, that's not tile that's going to be covered, you're going to be covering it with self-leveling. There is no need for the process. So underlayment the process. So underlayment is to isolate your floor from the subfloor, to keep tiles and Grout lines from cracking. Well, if you're doing LVT or if you're doing linoleum, there is no Grout line. There are no tiles to crack. So you don't need to buy this membrane. There are some other companies that the only way they sell their product and installed is with a membrane. But every single job does not require a membrane. So if you're doing a job that doesn't require the membrane, then why spend the extra hundreds of dollars for that membrane? Just get the cable fixing strips that come with the cable automatically and do your installation and save yourself a lot of money. Absolutely and if you ever have questions on which option is best for you, we're always happy to help out. So os.environ is our other floor heating product that is pretty common and pretty popular. It's going to go under floating floors. So this is really great with carpet. If you're in the states, laminate and flooring, hardwood, it comes in both roles and mats. So we have kind of criticized small mats that are really great for spot heating, certain areas of a space that are just a little bit extra cold or that you want to take the chill out of. And then we also have those cut and turn mats for environment as well. Yeah, this stuff is great for people that like I have a bedroom that's over a garage, an unheated garage. So my bedroom in the wintertime is very cold because it gets cold from below, from the sides and from the top. So what is good with this product is it can go between your carpet pad and your carpet in the United States. And you can heat that room using floor heating. So it's a great, great thing for bedrooms above unheated areas. It's also great for basements. So you can put that in a basement floor because that way you can put laminar or floating hardwood. One of the things that we see every day here at WarmlyYours is people will say, oh, floating for my LVT is a floating floor. I'm going to buy environ for LVT And that's where 2 and 2 doesn't equal 4. Yeah it just because it floats doesn't mean that it can be used with environ because if you can see there, you can see the environ, you can see the wires, kind of see the ripples in the product and you can't feel that under carpet and you definitely can't feel that under laminate or engineered hardwood. But the thing about vinyl is it has a property that's called drape, and vinyl draped means that it starts over time to conform to what's below it. So if you have a great big v-shape in the middle of your floor, eventually your floor is going to go from flat to shaped like a V. So that's what you've got is a bunch of little V's over all these heating wires. So eventually you're going to see a wavy floor because the LV is going to drape itself over that and then start to show what's below it. So that's why you need the temp zone product with self-leveling, and that is what's going to be the perfect installation as opposed to os.environ environs. Great for something that's rigid like laminate, something rigid like engineered wood or something that's flexible like carpet. So that's what os.environ really. That's a sweet spot for os.environ. All right. And then moving on to underlayment. So we offer CeraZorb which is a synthetic cork and this is a really great option when going over a slab. So can you kind of tell us, Scott, why anybody would want this if they're heating over a slab? Because they want they're buying a warm floor product. Right so really, they want a floor that feels warm. Well, if you don't use it in a series or to isolate the heating wire from the slab, if you just put that heating wire directly on the slab, it's going to pull all the heat from the wire down into the slab to try to heat the slab. That's just the way it is. And this picture is great because it shows we left. We did an installation in a room and we left one of the corners without Sarah's orb. So you can see using a thermal camera the difference of the heating. And this is just after it was turned on for a little while, you can see that the insulated areas where the wire has been isolated from the slab, they get 79 degrees. The non heated area is only getting up to 75. So you are going to have a perceived difference in temperature under your feet. So when someone says, hey, you know what I'm thinking about hitting my over a concrete slab and they'll say, do I really need CERS or do I not need service or. The thing is, people will have what we kind of used to describe it as. Do you want your floor to feel not cold or do you want your floor to feel warm? If you want your floor to feel warm, then you need to get that wire off of the slab and isolated from the slab using series. Or if you want to spend that money, that time and effort, just so the floor doesn't feel cold, but you walk in and you go, man, you know what's so great about this floor? It's because it's only able. Sometimes these words can only get into the seventies, you know, especially on really cold days in the midwest, in a basement. This floor may only get 70 some degrees. We have people that call us, they go, my floor is only getting 73 degrees and I put this floor heat in it. Well, it's because your slab is probably 30 degrees and it's trying to pull all that heat Downward. And that's what you get, as opposed to someone who put it in and go, you know what? My floor feels nice and toasty when I step out of the shower. That's the kind of difference that you're going to feel. Sarah's work can also be used as the underlayment for os.environ because os.environ is never set on a subfloor. That's hard. It always has to be over some sort of pad because it needs to allow the cable to sink into it because you can't hit a hard surface on top. And a hard surface on the bottom. As you step on it, it moves it like this. And what happens is it starts to a braid, the wire. So that's why the requirement is one layer of some sort of pad. Why not use Sarah's orb? Because it's going to make your floor a lot warmer. So you put the series orb down and you can even use it for floating installations. So what's great about those os.environ installations is you can lay the series orb down loosely, you can then put the heating product, the os.environ on top of it, and then use a floating floor on top of that. That's the easiest type of installation you can do with floor. Heating is floating, floating and floating. So if someone wants something that is really simple to install, give you a nice warm feeling on your feet. It's that type of product. But here we can see exactly what the surface or dub does. It makes the floor warmer in the areas that it resides, and it's great for basements because it doesn't have any natural component. It's synthetic, which means if you're were to use caught in that spot and it got wet, you would have mold, but you will not have it with series or because the mold has nothing to eat when it comes to surgery or because it's synthetic. So great, great underlayment. We're one of the first companies this was originally. So I'm going to go down the rabbit hole for just a second. But this product originally came as a sound debtor, and people in condominiums had to put it on the concrete slab and then put tile over the top. So every time somebody above you in the condo, above you walked across the tile floor, you wouldn't hear it. So we said, well, let's take a look at this stuff. And it and it said, you know what? This has got a great r-value. This will be great to keep that hot wire from getting all soaked up by that concrete. And we've been using it ever since. We're one of the first companies to do that. So we have our product custom made for us. It's 6 millimeter thick, right around a quarter of an inch. So that's what the story is for series order. And that's why it's so good. The proof is in the picture right there. Yeah, absolutely. I love that picture. And then we also have comfort heating items, so we have radiant panels available. These are basically going to be they can be hung in a lot of different places. So you can have them on a stand, kind of standing on the floor, hanging from the ceiling, hanging on a wall. So pretty much anywhere that you need a little bit of extra warmth, the upper panels are going to be a really great option. They can be plugged in as is, or they can be very easily modified, very hard wired connection. And then with the hardware connection, you can also control it through a thermostat. So again, you really have a lot of what was worthy control over of the system itself. And making sure that you were having the heat where you want it when you want it. Tim as the question is, can you inset these into a wall? You cannot put them in a wall. They can be put into a cove, but you can't get them to be flat with an input drywall exactly around them. You could set them into a cove, maybe a couple of inches deep, but you have to have space around it to allow any convection heat to get out. So these cannot be mounted inside of a wall or as part of a wall, it has to sit out. Part of the wall listings or the TV listing says you have to use the original mounting hardware that will keep it a certain distance from the wall. And that will keep your listing. So great question, TAM. Thank you for asking it. And these are a great panels. Yes, there is a gap needed around that. If you need some more information about that, you feel free to contact us at our sales department. We can get you the sales sheet on these and the installation manual will be glad to do that and we can get that on the way to and it'll say what the distances are. It needs to be from combustible materials and that sort of thing. These things get very, very warm. People sometimes get them and say, I didn't realize it got that hot. It's like buying an iron. Oh, I didn't realize that the iron would get that hot. That iron has got to get really hot for it to do its job. Right and so do these panels. So these are the type of things where, you know, putting them on the ceiling is a great place, because what they are is they're giving off far infrared rays and it's very much like the sun. So if you put that on a ceiling in the middle of a room, it's going to be like the sun in your ceiling and it's going to send heat down wherever you can see it. Now, if you do what we call the shadow effect, a shadow, like if you walk outdoors and you stand in the sun, it's hot and you get under a tree in the shade, it's going to be cooler. Well, it's the same thing with these things because they are radiating at you. So if you were to get behind a wall and you would not feel that heating longer, you would because what it's doing is it's actually heating you. Not so much the air, but it will heat up the items in the room until eventually that will give off enough heat that the room temperatures will increase. And that's how you can use them with a thermostat. So what you do is you put these on the wall where you put them on the ceiling. And you can control them with the thermostat. So what you do is you put the thermostat by the doorway and what you can do is set them for the ambient temperature and then you can have it come on and off the heat, the temperature the same in the room. So you just send a line of power from your breaker to your thermostat, then from your thermostat to the spot where your panel will be. And that's how you can control the temperature in your room using these. Or you can just simply plug them in and unplug them. Awesome yeah, absolutely. Those are really great options. If you aren't looking at, you know, redoing an entire floor, just want a little bit of extra warmth somewhere. What originally what we decided when we first started offering these were for people that missed putting the heat in the floor because a lot of people, you know, when you build a new house, you don't realize, oh, man, I could have heat, I could have heated my floors. I had a friend, but $1,000,000 house. But she never she did a sunroom, but she didn't realize that you could actually heat the tile. This room is always really cold. Well, perfect for her, instead of ripping up her floor that she had just put in is to simply buy a radiant panel and put it on the wall, and that'll give you some extra heat in that space. So they're very, very good at that. And that's kind of why we came up with them and why we started offering them years and years ago. Awesome and then we also have our indoor slab heating, which we don't see used as often, but is a really great. And actually I think I'm seeing it becoming a little bit more popular as people are using Finish Concrete floors a bit more in their spaces, in their residential spaces. But it's a really great option if the concrete slab is going to be the finished floor. So you're not going to be putting tile or carpet over the top of it. And it's the same kind of concept we have the slab heating that the slab heating cable, and those will just be set into the concrete with a concrete pour over the top. Yeah, and this is a great product. If you're pouring a new concrete slab, if your slab is already there, you're not using this product. That's one of the main questions we get. Oh, I want to heat my slab. Is your heat is your slab already there? Yes OK. Well, you can't use this product, but if you're putting in a new slab and you want to use Finish Concrete as your final flooring surface, which means you're just putting this product in, you're pouring concrete in it and through it. And on top of it. And then you finish the concrete that is your finished floor. It's a perfect product for that. So also I think another real popular getting more popular is because people are doing solar heat now, you know, solar power and they are using that to heat the slab with their solar power, which works fantastically also. Awesome So one of our big I think draws that we can offer our customers is our smart plans. So this is a really good example of one. These are a little subset, really little, however large of a space you're heating will take a layout of that if you can send in just a layout with the dimensions and anything that we know. So, you know, locations of cabinets, toilets, showers, things like that. A rough sketch is fine, which doesn't need to be pretty as long as it's relatively accurate. From there, we can actually draw up a plan that looks something like this that's going to show you exactly which product you'll want to purchase, exactly how you'll be cutting and turning it to fit into your space as well as, you know, a lot of little different specs and things like that. So you really have a good game plan going into the installation process. Yeah, this plan, the people that already work for us excuse me already know that we do this. I can tell right away when I speak to somebody on the phone who has either bought product in the past from some other company or who's never bought it before. Because what they do is they say, well, I don't know if I want to plan because, one, they think that we charge for plans like a lot of companies do and we do not charge for plans. Our plans are free and they go, I don't know if I can wait that long, and I know that there are other companies that can sometimes take a week to 10 days to do a plan. If you get us, your information will usually have that plan done for you. The next day unless you run up against a holiday or something odd like that. So you're going to get this plan free of charge and you're going to get it very quickly. So those two reasons to not send us a diagram are kind of out the window. So what's so great about these plans? If you've never done an installation before, why try to figure out how to lay the product out when you've never done it before? When we have engineers that do it hundreds of times every day and they've worked with these over and over for years, and there's a great bit of bonus that you're going to get from a team that does this design over and over and over again instead of trying to figure it out yourself. How many square feet do I need? Well, not every square foot is heated because you have to allow for a cabinet, you have to allow for toilets, you have to allow for air vents, all that stuff. That's all the engineers are going to do that. And once we're done, you'll then know what size breaker you need. You'll need you'll know how many, what's the product is, you'll know how to lay it out, and you'll also know what your daily cost is. You can figure that out without much issue. And it's a great, great way to do that. First installation, we try to do the thinking for you, so you just go out there, cut and turn it, do it and you're done and you don't have to sit there and go, oh, you know what? I ordered too much wire. Can I cut it? No, you can never, ever cut your wire. I don't have enough wire. What do I do? Well, then you have a whole thing, so don't go down that road. All you need to do is make a sketch us. Put it on a piece of napkin. If you want to take a picture and put the dimensions on there and send it to us. And we will do that for you. So very, very simple. Take the load off your brain. Let somebody else do it. Absolutely and you're not kidding about getting it on napkins. I've had it recently sent over on a piece of like 2 by 4. Someone Drew it on with a Sharpie, which was I mean, it worked. It was it wasn't super pretty, but it worked. And that's all that matters. So absolutely, senator, then we're happy to take that load off your back. Yeah, we got a tarp Senate. We've actually a couple of tarps. Were they put a tarp, an old tarp in a room and they just cut around the edges and they said, here, can you do this? And we did it. So however you need to get the information to us, you're more than welcome. Just don't forget to include your air vents if you have them in the floor, because you can't beat over an air vent. Good point. Yes, absolutely. That's something I would forget. So good. Good reminder. All right. And then we also have different with all the smart plans are going to look a little bit different, obviously, based on the room as well as what kind of products they're using. So we offer smart plans for all of our product or all of our heating products are for heating, snowmelt, heat and things like that. This is for cable with that for us. So underlayment and because that for us, though does cause a bit of a difference in the floor, you will want to have it underneath the entirety of the tiling even where you're not going to be putting heat. So you kind of see that highlighted blue area is where the ISO will be going. And then that red line is the actual cable itself. And can you kind of tell us, Scott, what that red dot is? Yeah, that red dot is the halfway mark. If you look there by the shower in the tub over there in that corner, you can see that there is a red dot and that red dot corresponds with the White dot that's actually on the cable. So that's the way you can find out if you're using too much or too little cable halfway through instead of waiting all the way to the end and go, Oh geez, I got 30 extra feet of cable or I'm 20 feet cable short. Once you get to the halfway point, you can go, hey, I'm right here. This is going to work out perfectly because sometimes you can change the spacing, you can get a little bit closer to the wall or further away from the wall to help you. If you don't have enough cable, you can pull it from the walls because no one ever stands right up against the walls. There's little tricks like that you can do, and that's what makes using cable. For these odd areas and different sizes, it's a little more flexible because you can space it away from the walls differently. You can pull it away from the walls because remember, when you're doing an installation like this, you want to walk around the room and just go. I need to make sure that these parts of the room are warm up against the wall. No one's ever going to be standing there, so I can pull the heat a little bit away from that. But I want to make sure that I have heat right in front of the vanity because that's where we stand all the time and put our contacts in or do whatever, you know. And also when we step out of the shower, we want to make sure that that's warm, but we can get a little bit further away from the tub because no one ever stands out of the tub and then goes and puts their foot over the tub and then puts it directly down against the wall because, you know, you don't do that. So when you get out of the tub, I always do that when I'm doing an installation, if there's a tub there, I'll just stand in the tub and then I'll get out and I'll see where my foot is because that's where we need to make sure that the heat is. So use that dot to measure to get your measurements correct. And you if you've used. If you've already got the White spot on your cable and you're only into your first four or five runs, it tells you you've probably have it space too close together because if you look here, you can see it says halfway mark for the cable and each run is spaced at 3.75. If you're doing it 1 to close, that would be 2 and 1/2 and you would get to that white spot way before on the cable, way before you would on the red spot on your plan. So that is a great question. I've got a question here. Did you see that? It says, I came in late. When do we want? Yes, I believe that's in reference to a protest specifically. Oh, OK. Protest so is when you want to make sure that you. You want to try to eliminate any cracks that come in your tile as a result of your sub for moving. Because what it does is that it actually takes your subfloor and isolates it from the tile so your subfloor can move, but the tile stays in place. That's how Roman tile floors are still intact over thousands of years, is because they had a subfloor. They put sand on it, then they put tile on top of the sand and the subfloor moved all over the place. But because of the sand was your isolation. It kept the tile in place. So that's what it's doing in a, you know, a 21st century setup as opposed to a, you know, a 22 BC type setup. But it's kind of like the same idea. What goes around comes around, right? Yeah, they really had it in a couple of ways there. So looking at loose cable as well. So this is another way to install that loose cable and this is a really good option when working with nailed hardwood. So can you kind of tell us what we're looking at here and how the sleepers work with the nails? Heartwood well, what you're going to do is nailed. Hardwood is its own beast, and you need to tell us a few things when you're doing a nailed hardwood and you need to ask certain questions when you're of the flooring manufacturer, when it's being installed, is how close to the nails have to be together? Do they have to be every eight inches? Do they have to be every 12 inches or what is that distance? That's called the nail rate. And that distance is going to correspond with these dotted lines in the plans because that's where your sleepers are. So what sleepers are, as are about a half inch thick, they're about two inches wide and they're put down in strips across the floor. And you can see on this particular floor, in between the cables, we have one, two, three, four, five, six, seven runs of sleeper between the cable. There's going to be a run here, and there's usually a run around the outer edge, too, because you've got a poor self-leveling on this. So what happens is you take the cables and you lay them between the sleepers into what we call troughs. And you put those cables in the troughs, and then once the cables are all done, you fill that trough with self-leveling right up to the top of your sleeper. And that gives you a perfectly flat floor that you would is going to sit on and get nailed into. So you're going to need to tell us which direction you want the wood to go this way or this way, because that depends on cause your sleepers are always going to be opposite. Because you have to be able to nail into them. So that's going to come in. So you tell us which direction the Wood's going to go. You tell us what the nail rate is, what the distances are. Also, find out what the maximum temperature that it's allowed. The national hardwood flooring association, I think, has a recommendation of in the 80s. So somewhere 80, 81, 82 depends on if the flooring manufactures. Some flooring manufacturers may say 85 is fine. Well, we know when it comes to hardwood floors, what's more impactful on the floor is not the heat, but it's the humidity in the room. So if you have a hardwood floor and you don't humidify in the winter, it's going to gap. And if you don't dehumidifier in the summer, it's going to. Get closer. And it's going to buckle. So you need to watch out. The most important thing when it comes to hardwood floors is the relative humidity, not whether there's heat under it or not, because normally a hardwood floor manufacturer will say you can set it to 82 or you can set at 85, but you need to make sure that the temperature stays the same all the time. You can't set it back to 65 at night and set it up to 85 during the day. You have to keep some not all of them say that, but some do say you can't do a setback temperature. And that's why that is 85. Set it back to 60 and then bring it back up. You have to keep the same temperature all the time. Well, if you keep the temperature the same way all the time, it's not going to expand and contract. It's going to go to one place and stay there. What will affect it is the relative humidity. So if you have no humidity in that room, it's going to go up. It's just the way wood is, whether there was heat under it or not. And the thing is, electric for heating. Underwood usually doesn't get the floor warmer than, say, sun coming in from the window. Sunday coming in from the window can get your hardwood floor 100 degrees or 105 degrees. Our floor will never do our heat will never do that. It'll get it to 82 or 83 and on thermostat you'll set it there and will stay there. So there's a lot of things you need to look out for with hardwood. But I did a hardwood installation, I don't know, five or six, seven or eight years ago. And that floor is turned on, ramped up in the fall, set to 82, and it stays there all winter long until the spring. And then ramp it down from 82 until it's off a couple of degrees every day. And there is no gapping in that floor at all because the temperature is always the same. So that's what's so great about doing hardwood. So those are the things you want to look for. You want to tell us, you know, how often the nails have to go in. Also, one thing I'm kind of droning on, but hardwood is a pretty big installation. And it's beautiful when you're done because that floor is really warm, especially in these rooms that have two story high ceilings with the really high ceilings that he tends to go up to the ceiling where you heat the floor and that entire room is nice and warm. So what you want to do here is you always want to make sure you look on the plan. And notice these numbers in the green. These numbers in the green are telling you how far away from the wall these fixing strips are located. Because if it says 7 and 1/2 there. So if you actually put this fixing strip 2 inches from the wall, you're going to run out of cable because you're using more per width than was designed. So you have to make sure that your cable fixing strip is 7 and 1/2 inches from the wall on the side. 7 and 1/2 inches from the wall on that side. And that's where all the calculations are based on that and the sleeper spacing. So if you change one of those and you don't tell us, you're either going to run out of cable or you're going to have too much cable. So if you start making it narrower, you're going to have cable left over. If you make it wider, you're not going to have enough cable. So those are the things you want to look for when it comes to hardwood heating. Absolutely and then also we had had a question earlier about the shower heating. And this is a great example showing kind of how a good way to heat the shower is with a separate cable. Can you kind of tell us why that is, Scott, or what specifically why you would want to have a separate heating system for the shower itself? Depending on the floor on how the shower floor is made, you can run into installations that are three or four inches thick of mud pack and sand and not sand, but different layers. Well, the thicker your mud pack is, the longer it's going to take because you have more thermal mass there to heat in the floor. The thin. So it's only 3/8 of an inch thick. And your tile, that's it. So the excuse me, the bathroom floor is going to heat much faster than a thick shower floor. Also, if you're doing a shower bench, which I strongly suggest you do, because it takes the pain out of sitting down, usually the bench in the shower, a lot of times, you know, sometimes it's tile, but sometimes it's like a inch piece of granite or a 2 inch piece of marble or whatever it is to sit on that thickness is going to take longer to heat because this thicker it is, the longer it takes to heat. So you may want to have your shower area warmer and come on sooner than the rest of the floor. So also, if you only shower in the morning, then there's no need to turn it on at night like we do with the rest of the floor. So that's going to save you some money and it's going to make that space more comfortable. Also, in the real world, people get into trouble when they start doing work around drains where they put screws in or they want to do something around the drain. Well, if that installer got that wire a little bit too close to the drain and it gets nicked and damaged. You can say, hey, you know what, I don't want any just about any floor can be fixed. But if they say, you know what, I don't want to mess with this, let's just disconnect the shower. Then you can disconnect the shower and the rest of the room still works. So those are the main reasons why you want them, at least on separate cables and sometimes on separate controls, too. So just think about that when you're doing it. Now your thermostat, you can have as many mats hooked up to your thermostat as you want, as long as they total less than 15 amps. You can have 37 Mets of 1 amp each and you go, oops, I'm in trouble. I'm at 37 amps. My thermostat will never hook, will never work. But if you want to do two or three mats, that's OK. The more connections you have, the more difficult it is to get the cables up the wall, though. But you can attach as many mats as you want to or cables as you want to, as long as they total less than 15 amps. So that's one thing you want to look at. Look around. And one other thing on here. Notice how this is all in 120 volt. There's a misconception out there and I don't know where it comes from, where a lot of electricians go. OK, that's floor heat I need to use to 40 volts. You don't need to use 240 volts for both. A 240 volt system heats the same as a 120 volt system, and if you're only doing 30 or 40 square feet, you only need 120 volt. And that saves you a breaker space because in a breaker panel, 120 volt takes one space to 40 volt takes two spaces, and there's no need to use that two spaces if you can get by with one. So for some people that have one spot left in their breaker panel like me, then you've got to make your choice. What am I going to do with this one extra spot in my breaker panel? Use 120 volt. There you go. So that's why all of our bathrooms are designed in 120 volt as long as it's less than 120 square feet. Because when you get that, because that will let you do one control for that amount of square feet. If you get over 120 square feet, you're going to want to go 2 to 40 volt because that'll still keep you on one control. So once again, we're going to get back out of the rabbit hole and move on to our next smart plant. I think that is also important information to have, Scott, because it really highlights exactly how much thought needs to go into it and why kind of, you know, trying to MacGyver it yourself and figure it all out yourself can be a little bit more difficult than it needs to be. And why the smart plants are so helpful and so important. Exactly and then this is a smart plan for environs. So this is going to be the same kind of concept, the cut and turn of the mats. And then you can also see that you're going to want to be staying a few, usually a foot or two away from the wall as well, especially with os.environ with carpet. That tends to be something to keep in mind again, if you're in the United States. Yeah, because the reason why there's a foot gap, there's two reasons really why there is a foot gap all the way around the room. First of all, no one usually stands within one foot of the wall. If you're a big person like me, I get bigger every year. Is that I? I can't stand close to the wall. I get further and further away from the wall. Every year I get larger. But the thing is, you never stand right on that wall. And the second thing is that you have to if you're doing carpet, is you have to give room for that carpet stretcher to grab the carpet and push and then put it down in the carpet tacks strip. So you need that room to get that stretch head, too, to be able to grab into the carpet without hitting the os.environ under it. So that's one thing you want to look out for in the US when you're doing carpeting. So one thing that we haven't talked about yet is on these smart plans is that you want to tell us where the thermostat is. Also, because if you have a preferred spot for the thermostat, please let us know, because these leads are 15 feet long. So if you put the thermostat over here, we need to turn this whole plan around and started over here. But if you're doing your thermostat over here, the triangles represent the start of the map. And here's another start of the map and here's the square which represents the end. So you can see if the thermostats up here, we want to put that thermostat t on our plan. And say, this is where I want it because this is the doorway there we're coming into. So that's another important thing. I'm glad we remember that before we left it. And you know what? I think the next slide is going to deal with thermostats. It is. And this is a really great chart kind of showing the difference between the thermostats we have available currently. So it's really going to depend on how you're planning to use the system if you're looking at using maybe a hardwood floor like we talked about earlier, where you really don't want to be changing the temperature often or at all, or if you just know that this is a seasonal space, you're going to want heated, you know, basically the entire winter and then turned off in the summer. The interest non programmable thermostat is going to probably be your best bet. We also have enhanced. It's our cheapest programmable option and it's really ideal for the much older systems that we previously offered with the regulator type control, which is like the dial that will kind of turn it up between I think it's one in ten, right? Scott right. So this is going to be a really great option if you're switching one of those out. This acts as a regulator. Otherwise if you're looking at something programmable, we usually recommend the InspirED touch. It is our most user friendly option. It's going to give you that seven day programming. It has a complete color touch screen, the setup wizard. It makes it really easy for the four to set up and to have it running, you know, kind of how you need it, where you need it. And then we also have the InspirED touch Wi fi, which is essentially the same thing, but it also has Wi-Fi capability so that you're also able to control it through an app on the phone. Yeah and we were talking about hardwood floors where you can't set do a setback temperature. It's going to be set it. Leave it there forever. It's kind of funny. The most expensive floors sometimes have that requirement and you're using the least expensive thermostat to control the most expensive floors. So it's kind of like inversely of what you would think. And a lot of people we've been selling electric floor heat for 20 plus years and we have zillions and zillions. I'm stretching the truth here. I don't even know what a zillion is, but there are a lot of floors out there that we've installed over the years that we've supplied the products for. And there are thermostats out there of different kinds. What I'm trying to get at the old Honeywell thermostat with the doors on the front, those are very old units. They're very difficult to program, and they are. They're getting to the age now where they're kind of aging out there, reached the end of their functional life. They do not last forever. Thermostats like this are line voltage, which means you're sending 120 volts into them and 120 volts are going out to them. They don't when they're regulating the temperature of the floor, they're not changing the voltage as it comes in and leaves. They're not changing 120 into 80 volts to make it a little bit cooler or into 60 votes to make a little bit cooler. It's not doing that. I think a lot of people think that. I've talked to thousands of people that do think that. But what it's doing is it's turning it on and off for longer amounts of time to make it warmer, and it's turning it on and off for shorter amounts of time to get it cooler. It's the amount of time that it's on per hour that it's going to regulate your temperature. So if you have a 120 volt floor, you can't send 100 and/or you can't send 240 volts to the thermostat, and the thermostat is going to change to 40 into 120. It's not going to do that. Even though the new thermostats are dual voltage, it means if you send 240 to them, they'll send to 40 out. Or if you send 120 to them, they'll send 120 out. That's what dual voltage means. It doesn't mean it changes to 40 to 120. So that's one common misconception people have. And one thing to get back to circle the wagon here is if you have one of those old thermostats with the doors on the front and it's giving you a hard time, any of these units will replace it. They're all direct replacements of that unit. They might be slightly wider or slightly higher, but they fit in the same box. So you'll never know that the old thermostat was there if you replace it with this one. So these are drop in replacements. The thermostat sensor that was probably that's in the four can, nine times out of 10 be used by these thermostats. So that's what's so great. That's what I wanted to bring your attention to where it says floor sensor compatibility. And for sensor compatibility 10-k or 10:12 a.m., it's really supposed to be 10-k on 12. Com or custom. That means that most of the sensors out there are Honeywell's were 10 carbon sensors a lot of the old OJ controls that were these. There's only a few big players in for heating controls. Honeywell was the big one. And OJ is kind of like taking over most of the flaws. Some of the old OJ thermostats were 12k. But the good thing about these thermostats is you can switch it to 10 or 12k and it works for both types that we sold. So these were replace anything that we've sold in the last 20 plus years. So these are all direct replacements. And the good thing about them is you can get them to look really pretty. Yeah we do have some beautiful, radiant crystal options that are made with Austrian crystals. So if you're looking for something to give the, you know, your floor heating system, a little bit of visitors, a little bit more personality to fit your decor. We usually have something for you that will work out that way. So on our web site, we have a lot of different information for you to begin planning out your system. One of our most popular and most helpful tools is our instant quote tool. And so this is going to actually let you build your system from scratch. So you'll answer some questions about it, including the size of the system, the type of subfloor the flooring will be installing, things like that. And then from there, it's going to help you pick out which system you want to install. As you can see, it will have a video showing the installation process. It'll have all of the specs listed on there, and you can click through each option, learn more about each option available to you, and really build your system. And then from there, you can either just purchase it directly or you can reach out to us and we can take a look at it and make sure that it is the right system for you and get a smart plan going. Now, earlier, we talked about temps on cable with Progreso and without Progreso. And this is the perfect slide that shows that because we can install our floor heating in multiple different ways. Some companies only have one way to do it, and that is to buy a membrane and you have to buy the membrane to be able to put it in. Well, you can see here, if you can do without that membrane, if you're in an A space where you're not going to be needing it to for its cracks, suppression or for its isolation, if you're going to be doing a job that's like self-leveling for LV ti, there is no need to spend that. What is it? What's the difference there? Almost $300. That's a big deal. You do a couple rooms like that. You've just saved yourself $600 in cost because you don't need that membrane for every job. So just keep that in mind. That's part of your installation, too. We also offer on our website a design tool. So if this is a really good way to get your smart plan started, you can actually design your room on our website. And we were one of the first companies to really offer this, to really help you plan out your system from beginning to end. So this is going to give you the option to customize your room shape. You can put furniture in their cabinets, things like that. And then from there we can actually take that layout and draw up your smart plan for you. So if you don't feel like doing it on a tarp or if you don't feel like doing it on a pizza box, this is another great option. And then we also have our heat loss calculator. That's going to be a really, really helpful tool if you're looking at potentially using these systems as your primary source of heat. Can you kind of tell us, Scott, why this would matter? Well, because people will call and say, I want to put this in my floor. I want it to heat my room. Will it work? Will it heat the room to 75 degrees? Will heated 72? I don't know, because we need to different things about that room to be able to tell you, yes, you have enough to use or you don't have enough to use. So I want you to think about and I'm going to go down this rabbit hole because this is another this is a reason why you always put each room on its own control, because let's say that you have a very small bathroom and you have a huge recreation room in there right next to each other. And you put the thermostat for this and you try to tie these systems together. People automate when they've never had radiant heat. They go, I want one thermostat, and then that I want all these rooms to turn on when that thermostat comes on. And you you don't want that. You want a control in every room. And the reason why is small bathroom, large rec room next door. If you put the thermostat in the bathroom, the bathroom is going to feel comfortable because it's very small. It has no exterior windows, it has no heat loss, it doesn't have any skylights. So it's not going to lose any heat. So that room is always going to be perfect. What you set it for this other room with a bunch of Windows and skylights and fireplaces, that room is always going to be cold. So what you have to do then is turn the thermostat up in the little tiny bathroom to make it warmer in that big space. Well, when you walk from that big space into this bathroom, it's going to be like walking into an oven, because that's the difference. That's what heat loss is. Heat loss is here. Here are the things, the main things that cause heat loss, windows on exterior walls. Now, window in an interior while you're probably in a recording studio. So you don't have to worry about that. But a window on an exterior wall is going to let heat out. The more windows you have on an exterior wall, the more heat is going to escape. The more exterior walls you have, the more heat is going to escape. If you have unheated space above you, if you have unheated space below you, that's going to lose more heat. So if you had to do a room, if I had to just guess and say, is this bathroom on the second floor, above the kitchen and under the bedroom on the third floor with no exterior walls? Is that room probably going to get warm? Yeah, I'd probably say, Yeah. You have a pretty good chance of making that room warm. If you have a giant rec room with three or four exterior walls, three, three exterior walls full of Windows and skylights and a fireplace, that's going to be a very difficult space to get warm because of all of those heat loss problems. So this is the product that's going to tell you, yes, you're going to be able to or no, you're not going to be able to. And if you're not able to, it'll say how many beats use your short. And if you do that, you can then say, hey, you know what, I'll just buy a bit of a space heater, a 500 BTU space heater that's going to get me over the top. So it'll tell you what exactly you need. So that's not something you can guess at, but you'll tell that you'll tell the machine when you're working on your internet machine. It'll tell you how many walls, how higher the ceilings, really high ceilings take more to heat that space because the heat goes up and it's hard to do. It's more difficult to fix that space. So that's what the heat loss calculator is going to do. It's going to tell you, yes, that will work or no, it won't. And this is how much you're short. Awesome absolutely. And then we also offer an operating cost calculator, which is a great way to kind of have an idea of what you're getting into in terms of the running cost per unit. So you'll pick your system, you'll pick your room size again. You can just use averages. Or if you have an exact square footage, you can put that in and draw. Your energy rates, however, is easiest for you to do so. And then you can play around. That's a sliding tool at the bottom that's letting you pick how many hours you're running the system. So for roughly eight hours a day, kind of a normal temp zone system and an average sized room in the Chicagoland area, you're looking at about $0.22 a day to heat. So you can actually kind of play around with that and see what you'll be looking at for day to day operating cost. Yeah and it's great. It's a lot of fun, too, because you move that slider back and forth. And you can definitely change the amount of, of, of what you're going to spend just by changing the number of hours that it's on. So it's common sense, but it's kind of neat to see what the cost is because it figures your zip code and it gets your actual electric rate to. So Scott, this is definitely going to be these next two slides are your Forte. Can you tell us what tools you'll want to have on site for the installation? Most of the installation is done with very, very common tools. You will need to go out and buy a digital o meter. They're very inexpensive. Now, I'm an older guy. When I was young, I used to train electricians on how to fix certain things. And back in those days, you said, I think you should get a digital o meter or a digital voltmeter. They go, oh, geez, those things are like $500 a piece. I'm not buying one of those. I'm buying one with an analog meter with the needle on the front. Those days are gone. These things are $10. Now you can get a digital o meter for 10 or 15 bucks and you're going to need one because you need to test your system before it's installed, before you lay it out. And if it tests good, then you're going to take the circuit check and you're going to put this on the wire while you lay it out on the floor, because the circuit check what it does. It's kind of like your eyes on the heater while you're busy laying it out. So if you drop a £10,000 weight on the floor and it damages the wire, this thing will scream at you because what it's doing is it's checking for shorts and it's checking for opens. So that's going to be your installation guide as you go. So you test it, you put the circuit check on, then you lay the product out on the floor, you take the circuit check off, and then you measure it again. If your floor is still good, your ohms are the correct reading. You can then start to put tile or your hardwood flooring or whatever you want to over the top as soon as you put your circuit check on. So don't forget to put your circuit check on after you do your second test. So you test it after you lay it out. Good put your circuit check on. Then you can start doing the tile. At the end, you take the digital meter and you take your readings and you write those numbers down in the installation manual. And those are the only specialized tools that you're going to need. Otherwise, it's like scissors and stuff like that. And just remember, I'm one. One of these would never be complete unless I say never, ever cut the heating cable. So we can go on from there. But those are the installation tools that you are going to need. Now, in case you have trouble. You're going to need a troubleshooting kit. Now, what's so good is one of the biggest I trying to get all these misconceptions out of the way here, too, because we deal with a lot of false information, a lot of assumptions that are made when it comes to electric freight. If something happens to your floor, you do not need to rip up the entire floor to fix it. You can fix the floor without ripping the entire thing up. I've fixed hundreds of flaws. One of them got wrapped up because it was damaged about 30 times by someone who cleaned Grout lines with a sharp knife and ruined the entire floor. So that's one time I've been doing this for 15 years. So that's what you see. Maybe the electrician that was there that day said, Oh yeah, that came out. We had to replace it. But they weren't there for the other 14 years, 364 days where you didn't have to rip it out. So what happens is these tools are used to make a hot spot in the floor. And when you see that hot spot, you take your thermal camera. What? you need the thermal camera to see that spot. So you create the hot spot. You take the thermal camera and you see where that hot spot is. And then you lift up that tile. You fix the wire and you put a replacement tile down on it and you're done. So that's what these tools are for. So if something happens, your floor, you don't have to rip it up 99 times out of 100. It's you just need to find the spot that got damaged by either someone drilling a hole for a doorstop. Please don't drill holes into the tile floor for doorstops. Had one this week. They did that as soon as you drill into the floor. Murphy's law is going to tell you that you're going to hit that wire. No way around it. Also for sliding doors, people love to put those guides down on the floor, screw them into the floor and then go back and forth. That's a problem. That's why you don't run the cable so close into a doorway. You keep it away from the doorway because you don't want to hit the transition from the carpet in the bedroom to the tile in the bathroom. With the tax, you know, with a reducer or whatever, with that screwed in. Also, people that put heating wire in showers and then they put glass doors on and they drill into the floor to put those glass windows on that does that sort of stuff. So these tools are great for finding that spot. So misconception cleared. I hope we never, ever I don't know how many people this is going to reach, but hopefully I never have to hear that said again. So fingers crossed. Scott we do have a quick question from George Brennan in the Ask a Question module saying I have an active request in with you for help on a non-working floor installed by a previous homeowner. Can I rent a shortstop? I'd like to have that along with using a tester. When you rent the troubleshooting kit from us, it comes with a shortstop and the high. Everything you do, everything you need to do, that repair. If you use a shortstop. A shortstop is what we use 20 years ago. And a shortstop really only tells you how far down the cable is. The problem where the problem is located on the cable, if you don't know how the cable was laid out, if it was laid out this way or if it was laid out that way, you don't know where that. If it says 200 feet, you don't know where that 200 feet is if they didn't use a plan. However, if you create a hot spot with a high spot, your camera will show you right where it is. So that is well, they seem to have followed. I've been doing this for a long time and they decide, hey, you know what, I'm going to I'm not going to make that turn. I'm going to make the turn over here. All I can tell you is I've repair. I go back a long way before we even had these tools. And I've repaired floors with the thermal film where you laid the thermal film every foot on the floor trying to find the hot spot or with the shortstop. These tools are going to save you time and heartache because they're going to show you exactly where the problem is and you're not going to be digging up different spots. You know, back in the day, if it said 200 feet, I'd go, OK, we'll use this plan and it looks like 200 feet right there. And I break up the tile and I find out that there's not even any wire there. So now we go, well, OK, well, these numbers are completely out of control. So I've had to do that in a bathroom. And it took me three or four times, three or four broken tiles to find that spot. So all I can tell you is from experience is you want to get the entire kit. The only time the shortstop really comes in handy is if it says 20 feet or if it says 700 feet. Because if it's 20 feet, that means it's somewhere around the thermostat because the cold lead that doesn't heat is 15 feet long. So, you know, that is probably about 15 feet long. So you only have to worry about five feet of that up from there. So that's usually within a 5 feet radius of where the thermostat box is. So that's about the only time the shortstop is good. If you want to rent the shortstop, you're more than welcome. The shortstop is free. All we do is we take a deposit on it, and it may help you. It may not. If you were asking me to go out and repair a floor, I would use these tools. Nine times out of 10 over a shortstop. And the good thing is, a shortstop comes in the kit, so you don't have to get it separately. So hopefully that answers your question. George, Thank you for asking that. Awesome OK. All right. So if you ever have any, you know, issues or questions, we love to help out. We consider ourselves radiant experts. And we really think that our company, we're obviously we're a little bit biased, but I think that we're a really special company because we really our customer focus, we want to make sure that you are as happy and as prepared for your project as you can be. So we have no restocking fees, no return fees. If you ever buy the wrong product or change your mind, feel free to let us know, and we will be happy to get you a return going again without any of those restocking fees that are very common with other companies. We also have 24/7 tech support, of which that is our main head. He is fabulous. All of our tech support team is. And at any point, day or night, you can give them a call with any questions or any troubleshooting help and that they will be more than happy to assist you, even if it's, you know, Christmas morning, we get you get calls on Thanksgiving I'm sure Scott things like that. And what you'll doing dig this. We had six calls on New Year's day. Now, I would expect these people to be sleeping in bed all day long and we get 6 calls on New Year's day. And the reason why that sticks out in my head is because I was laying in bed on New Year's day, too, because we stayed up too late. And, you know, do you want a phone call at 8:00 AM on New Year's day? So that's what we've been part of the hardest. We do some people wake up and they want to be warm. We're just laying in bed all day. How dare they? How dare us? I think is actually maybe the problem. So we are also, like I said, we like to consider ourselves a reading experts. We've been doing this for well over 20 years. And we have seen I mean, when I say we, I think Scott probably has seen the majority of every possible situation that can happen when installing or using a floor heating system. So we really know, you know, how this is going to work best for you and for your specific projects. We also offer what we call our no nonsense warranty. It is industry leading warranty where any manufacturer defects we're going to cover. So you don't ever have to worry about getting a product, putting tile down over it, and then it suddenly having an issue and being kind of stuck. If there are any manufacturer problems, then we will cover that 100% as well as the labor to replace it. Except that's really important, Linda, because of people right now, they are very, very concentrating on price and our prices are just, you know, are very, very competitive. However, if you call somebody on the weekend, odds are, you know, we do we pretty much we. I don't want to sound too boastful here, but we kind of support the entire industry because when people can't get through to brand x, when they can't get through to brand y, when they can't get through to brand w, they call us and go, listen, no one's getting back to us. What do we do? Can we rent our tools? We're about the only people in the industry that rent tools for repair. So we're kind of like the only game in town. So we support everybody's for and we can pretty much go out and repair anybody's floor because if it's electric heating cable, it's all pretty much the same thing. What's not the same thing as the warranty. Read the warranty. Because if there is a product, if there's a problem with our product and it's a defect, I mean, it hasn't been cut in half during the installation or someone didn't drop bucket of thinset that was 50 pounds on the cable and smash it. That's an installation issue. But if it's something where we made in our factory, splice failed. We're we're going to do whatever it takes to get that floor to work. So we're going to pay the labor for the tile person. We're going to pay the labor for the electrician. We're going to pay all those and. What if you look at a lot of warranties out there that aren't ours? It'll say we'll replace one tile that's directly over the bad spot or we will not pay for work for labor to replace that one tile over the bad spot or we won't play for any troubleshooting, that sort of stuff, or we're only liable for that one foot of cable. So we will reimburse you $0.47 for that one foot of cable that was damaged. So that's the kind of stuff you really want to read your warranties, because all warranties are not created the same. And that's where we came from. The no nonsense warranty, if it's a problem with our product and it was made incorrectly, it arrived and it didn't work. That's going to be taken care of by us as long as something as long as it wasn't damaged when it was put in. And what is damage? Screws for doorstops, you know, that sort of stuff. That's not a warranty issue. That's where it was damaged during installation. So those are the kind of things. That's why it's important to take it take note of how you're installing it because you want to if you do the installation and you follow the instructions, very rarely are there ever any problems. So that's what's so good about this type of flaw. Absolutely and we also offer we were really the first in the industry to provide an online tool for your project planning, for designing your room, for getting instant quotes, things like that. That was definitely something that we pioneered and we're very proud of. We also offer a dedicated account management, so you'll have an account manager assigned to you who will work with you directly, one on one, and making sure that all of your questions are answered immediately, that you are feeling completely confident and that everything that you need to going into your heating project. And of course, we also offer those 24 hour, roughly 24 hour turnaround on those smart plans. So you don't need to worry about, you know, not having enough time to get a plan. We will do that as quickly as possible for you so that you can begin using at your source or heating your system. So are there any other questions? And if something pops up while we do some housekeeping, feel free to ask away. Olivia was there anything on facebook? None on Facebook. OK awesome. Perfect oh, you know what, lynn? We do have some questions that were supplied to us ahead of time. Whenever people register for these, we do ask them, hey, give us some questions beforehand. We almost forgot. We almost did. I'm glad you reminded us. So our first question that was sent ahead of time is from Chris wanting to know about approved for coverings for our heated systems and there are zillion. I love the term zillions. There are a bazillions of fora installed for manufacturers. Each one of them have different rules, so there's really no way that we can keep track of every single flooring manufacturer and what their recommendations are. The simplest thing is to ask them so we can heat just about anything. But you have to ask the people that are making the anything. If we can heat it or not. If we can heat it, we will. So if you're asking about a hardwood. It's going to be in the installation manual where you can ask your sales reps, say, hey, you know, what is for sales rep? Is this radiant heat approved? Can you use radiant heating with this? So we don't really have an approved flooring list because we just can't keep track of it. changes every day. So the simplest thing is just simply call the manufacturer. Absolutely we also have a question on electric versus hydraulic. So basically, you know, those are the two main types of four heating systems. Hydraulic, obviously, it was probably the first really commonly used. And what a lot of people are very familiar with and everything we offer is obviously electric. I can say that I think one of the biggest draws of electric over hydraulic systems is that there is no annual maintenance needed. Once it is put in the floor, you are basically good to go relatively indefinitely with hydraulic. You have boilers, you have pipes, there's risk of things leaking. The boilers need annual maintenance, so there is a lot more room for failure with hydraulic systems and a lot more just kind of general upkeep that is necessary to keep those working the way that they should be. Whereas electric is pretty much one and done and you don't have to worry about it again moving forward. Yeah, I've dealt with people that have bought hydraulic before and especially if this. If you're worried about floor height because if you're doing a remodel job, it's tough to say I need to raise this four, 3 inches for the pipes to fit in there when you can just raise the floor an 1/8 of an inch or a little bit more to fit electric for heating. Also, some people actually have hydraulic homes and they build an addition on and they have a bathroom on the other side of the room, on the other side of the house where they can't get the pipes to. Then what you do is you just put you know, you get a circuit there and you put electric for heating in there. So that's what you're looking at. You're not worrying about valves. You know, the bell, the stock, you know, you don't worry about that because it's just electric. And I can also tell when people have dealt with a hydraulic in the past is because they'll say I'll say, well, send us a plan. We'll do a plan for you. And they go, oh, no, no, no, no. Well, because our systems are so much easier to engineer than hot water plans, because you think about hot water, it leaves the boiler at a certain temperature. And it as soon as it leaves the boiler, the temperature drops as it makes its way to the spot where the floor is. It's dropped already. And then as it works its way through the floor, it drops. That's why you have to do these curlicues, and that's why you do these inner interpolated, shell type designs. Because otherwise, if you just ran it in one end and out the other, this part of the floor to be really hot. Net part of the would be cold. So they didn't want to wait for the drawing. And sometimes a hydraulic people won't even give you a plan unless you buy it because it takes so much longer to draw. So it was like, that's why our plans are free. Whether you buy it or not, it's included. So that's another big difference. Trying to install and design an electric 4 is much, much easier than a hot water floor and much less height difference in the floor, especially remodeling. So absolutely. And it's also really great. Electric is really great for that spot heating. So if you just have you know, you hate standing on the cold tile in front of the sink, but you don't want to have to have it throughout the entire house. It's just a really easy way to take the chill out of the floor in certain areas. Right good point. Cam asked about ambient panel control for overhead hardwire install. I'm assuming that too. Meaning the radiant panels. Radiant panels with the thermostat, which we covered. So that was good. I think we've got Tim's spot for that. And the thing is. OK so, tam, TAM is here? Yes all right. Very good, TAM. You're you're the MVP today. Sending us a question and asking more. Yay, yay, Yay. Keep going. And then one thing question. The last question we have is information about heating, shower floor and benchtop. And I think we talked about that also how bench the bench tops can be much thicker, taking longer to get warm where you might where you probably want that shower portion of your bathroom to be on its own control. So hopefully we addressed that for Stacy. That was a great question, Stacy. And I think we answered that already. So anybody have anything else besides that? If not, we'll keep looking. And like I said, we have some housekeeping to do. So if anything pops up, feel free to ask. Our next webinar is going to be installation tips for floor heating cable. So we're really going to be focusing on using that pedestrian membrane versus the fixing strobes. That will be February 9th at 1:00 Central right here on crowdcast. So please join us for that. And then we also offer here on crowdcast what we call our daily training sessions. These are usually at least once a day, almost twice a day, just five, 10 minute quick little sessions going over some really common topics that people like to discuss. And they're often hosted usually by me, often by Scott. So feel free to pop on in and ask any questions you might have during those training sessions. For the month of January, we are offering 25% off of select towel warmers. So be sure to visit our website for more information on that special. Once we are done here today, you will receive an email asking about your experience during today's webinar. We really appreciate hearing any comments. We really love suggestions, especially topics, suggestions that you'd like to see in the future. And I just personally, Scott and I really like compliments on our sense of humor, our hair, our, you know, kind of our outfits, all that stuff. So anything you want to tell us, please feel free to give us your feedback. Yeah, he said. You know, he'd look better with dark hair like he used to have than I'll get a dye bottle the day before. That's fine. No problem. We'll get that taken care of. Yeah we'd much rather talk about stuff that you're interested in. You know, he's like, I'm really interested in this type for what should I do? We'd love to know that because that means that there's probably other people interested in that, too. Absolutely and then, of course, if you have any other questions, if you want to get a quote started, if you want to purchase from us anything that you need, we're here for. So feel free to give us a call. You can always email us either our general informational email or you can reach out directly to Julia billon. She is our owner and our president. She loves chatting one on one with our customers. So if you have questions or anything you'd like to pass along to her, just feel free to email her directly. She would be ecstatic to hear from you. And you can always visit our website or our social media pages any time, day or night. Our website is really a treasure trove of information that is pretty much anything you would ever want to know about for heating, about our products, specs, things like that. There's going to be some information for. And Carolyn asks, will we be a cab? Is olivia? That is a question for you. I don't know. I'll stop in my head, I think. Yes this may be a rare sighting of Olivia. Olivia, what do you have for us? I should know this stuff. So I'm usually the one going. Oh, she typed it in instead. Oh, come on, Olivia. We will not be this year. But next we will be at the JLC, though, which is also pretty big. Yeah, that's in March. So so we couldn't coax. We almost coaxed Olivia. Tried while we give it a whirl. So that's a great, great spot to end. We almost had an appearance from Olivia, so I think that's a perfect place to stop. We treat her like she's some kind of crypt. And I'll Thank you so much for joining us. Until next time, as always, stay warm and be radiant. Thanks, everybody.

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